To be fair, this post also isn’t a meme
Well, where would such content go? I agree these things don’t fit the definition of a meme. But they aren’t jokes either. And there’s no c/randomFunnyStuff.
If you removed everything that isn’t a perfectly pure meme, this community would be very empty.
Maybe a Greentext-like community could be created, but for general funny or odd texts from the internet?
Well, where would such content go?
Wherever the picture-of-text memes go. The content is unchanged, the form should change.
There’s a microblog memes community.
Well, where would such content go? I agree these things don’t fit the definition of a meme. But they aren’t jokes either. And there’s no c/randomFunnyStuff.
People are lazy and meme communities are bigger so obviously they are going to post whatever content to the larger community for engagement. It’s not any more complicated than that. As long as meme communities are bigger and accept non-memes they will continue to be posted to appeal to the lowest common denominator.
…and, how does it become a meme without being posted as one…?
If you find the screenshot quote funny and memeable, make a meme out of it and post it here. But the screenshot itself is too little.
That’s like having c/sayings and people just write shit in it: “well how can it become a saying if we don’t treat it like one!” That makes no sense. It’s not for making sayings, it’s for things that ARE sayings.
There are things in the category already and the community, based on the name, should be for that.
I would recommend c/memematerial to be born to fill the niche you’re discussing.
I didn’t make this meme.
Then let me put it this way:
OP didn’t say that memes can’t be textual in nature, OP complains about snappy Twitter, 4Chan, Reddit (idk about this one? Reddit does have memes in some subs) or similarly sourced screenshots of texts.
Such posts, while possibly humorous, and occasionally a bit funny, are not spread rapidly by Internet users, and rarely posted with any variation.Example 1 - this is a meme:
“Nanomachines, son!”Example 2 - this is not a meme:
Example 2 is a meme, no doubt about it.
If you go any deeper than the surface-level Google definition (that you are pedantically picking apart), then you will find literally any idea or unit of culture is a meme.
Read the last chapter of Richard Dawkins’ The Selfish Gene. Actually please read the whole book, it’s a masterpiece of science popularization. Or read Susan Blackmore’s The Meme Machine, it explains the concept of memes and how they evolve in further detail.
Care to summarize what those books say that the surface-level Google definition provided to me by Antagonistic doesn’t?
I’m not going to read entire books just to defend my meme against another meme which defends a class of alleged memes.Well the definition is correct, it is Antagonistic’s narrow interpretation of that definition that is incorrect.
The key is evolution. For something to evolve, it must have the ability to be transferred, to be changed/mutated, and to be stored. Both genes and memes have these properties.
Literally any idea is a meme. If you can think it, it’s a meme.
If you break a gene in two, the result is two genes. If you break a meme in two, the result is two memes.
The name “Antagonistic” is a meme. The letter ‘A’ is a meme. The sound you make when you say ‘A’ is a meme. The idea of air vibrating to make sound is a meme.
That would mean that everything was a meme. And a definition that encompasses everything is worthless, arguably not even a definition (because nothing is defined).
I didn’t interpret anything. I posted a meme. Also, you misspelled my name if were meaning to mention me.
If any idea is a meme, is any meme an idea, and is there a direct causal relationship or is it a coincidence (or, can there be an idea that is not a meme)?
If so, and if the former, then the definition of “meme” is a synonym of “idea” and that would be that, but I don’t think most people use that definition.Note that I’m somewhat biased, loosely speaking I don’t consider raw microblog quips to fit a community / subreddit / virtual space called “memes”.
By your thinking, the letter A on a transparent background is a “meme”
To be fair,
… it is.
By the most useless definition of the word I guess, but I don’t see how it is supposed to be meaningful to anyone but a linguist with that specific opinion.
Yeah
If people post it around, it is.
When everything is a meme, nothing is. That is why often there is a distinction made between the Richarf Dawkins type of meme and the modern internet meme.
Wrong
When everything is a meme, nothing is
“When everything is made of genes, nothing is”
This is just an assertion, and a false one too.
Everything is a meme, and they behave exactly like genes. They replicate themselves, perfectly or imperfectly, and are then subject to competition for users’ attention which will affect their future replication.
Another meme is attempting to outcompete the screenshot genus of memes, by using you as a propagation tool: the “screenshots of text are not memes” meme.
This is just a silly over-intellectualization of a weird word you want to mean “thing, but fancier”. I agree with the person you’re replying to. If everything is a meme then the term is meaningless.
are not spread rapidly by Internet users, and rarely posted with any variation
Most of the shit on here hasn’t been shared widely or rapidly. They’re at best aspiring memes.
The community should be renamed non-memes. If not, then that community should be created & every non-meme here cross-posted there.
Hahaha, looks like we’re back to arguing about the old No True Memesmen falacy…
Screenshots of text that you don’t like aren’t memes because of reasons
I never said I don’t like the screenshot I referenced, I just looked up for “twitter screenshot” on DDG and took a representative link. I find the content of the screenshot mildly amusing.
However, many people (including me) do not consider those to be memes;
if the most widely recognized definition of the word includes them, then I question its usefulness beyond a synonim for “funny quote”.Many people including you are dead wrong
because of reasons
like definition. words mean things? what nonsense.
Reddit (idk about this one? Reddit does have memes in some subs)
But you are completely right about what I complain about. A meme often contains text, and sometimes even is purely text (for example a popcultural reference in a text-only medium can be considered a meme), but a single (maybe even witty) tweet or a forum discussion without any further context is maybe funny, but not a meme.
Haters gonna hate, but you deserve this.
spoiler
I mean, if the screenshot has been shared widely enough, it should be considered a meme by definition.
If the screenshot has been shared widely enough by many different people, yes, it should be considered a meme by definition.
“By many different people” isnt part of either of the above definitions.
Also, whats “many?” Whats “different” mean in this context? What is the threshold for a meme to meme? 10 people? 100? 1000?
Richard dawkins coined the term in 1976 and defined it as such:
A meme “conveys the idea of a unit of cultural transmission, or a unit of imitation”
“Many” may be me editorializing, but “internet people” implies that it’s not just one person posting the same thing in many places around the web and people liking it.
The hidden parts don’t matter, the part you can see is the part that says OP is wrong and nothing anywhere in the rest of the definition changes that
Is that an AI-answer?
It’s the dictionary definition
But then you are missing or leaving something out:
You can parody a piece of text. They literally just did it by overlaying wojack on top of the dictionary description.
Most posts here aren’t parodies. They’re just blanket text
Lol, I always love it when people have to split hairs so finely on definitions that they risk fission.
I made this joke elsewhere, but this is basically the No True Memesmen fallacy. The definition of meme includes these pictures, and trying to narrow the definition to exclude them is laughable.
When everything is a meme, nothing is. Ther is no adaptation, no cultural twist, no recontextualisation or any other relevant criteria in a screenshot of text and nothing else.
You keep saying that, it’s not getting any less wrong though
Ok, so just make up your own word that has the definition you want, or deal with your definition not being the same as others’. Because the definition of meme isn’t as specific as you want it to be.
Because the definition of meme
The Oxford Dictionary’s definition of a meme you meant to say.
For example, Jana Zündel (german article), a german meme researcher, stated that a meme always includes a recontextualisation. The Wiki page lists key characteristics such as intertextuality and cultural evolution.
There is a screenshot from reddit posted here earlier today, do you think that’s a meme? Can you take it, put it in a new context and have it keep its original context as a reference so that the new post would create a new idea building on the context? Or is it just a random story, maybe funny to some?
I’ve been wondering for sometime as to why those kinds of posts weren’t be removed and guided to another community. Like !microblogmemes@lemmy.world or !humor@lemmy.world
Maybe the rules re too lax, or the mods got used to let this go so the community gains traction.
Or people forget they’re supposed to report that crap.
!microblogmemes has a very narrow scope and !humor only wants “lighthearted” content. So these are only a partial replacement.
Bravo!
Most of the “real” memes that get posted are terrible, so I can’t say I mind too much.
Feel free to make your own quality memes.
I came here to say this to you. Be the change! Flood the zone with what you want to see. We’d all appreciate it.
Why fo you feel the need to tell me what I am already doing though?
Because you aren’t anymore. Where is today’s? I would like several please.
That’s literally what they did…
Hear, fucking hear.
wrong
Thank you!
A meme is an idea, behavior, or style that spreads by means of imitation from person to person within a culture and often carries symbolic meaning representing a particular phenomenon or theme.
-Wikipedia
You can argue that many of the text posts do not meet the criteria, but just as many of the shitty image macros posted don’t either.
You stopped reading too early.
I was the whole thing. That extra context still doesn’t require image macros or exclude purely textual memes. Also good job continuing to break accessibility with laziness.
with laziness
Nah, on the GP’s case, breaking accessibility requires a lot more effort than preserving it.
a meme was originally used to describe repeated patterns in genetics, and is fundamentally another way to say “mimic,” so we could build an argument for a totally different way to moderate content here.
but the spirit of the community is to showcase the modern internet meme, so I think taking the narrow definition of “new jokes over repeated images” is more appropriate than a literal definition of the word itself.
- not text only ⊗
I like to throw this one around on occasion.
This almost made a good point until it broke accessibility.
Images of text break much that text alternatives do not. Losses due to image of text lacking alternative:
- usability
- we can’t quote the text without pointless bullshit like retyping it or OCR
- text search is unavailable
- the system can’t
- reflow text to varied screen sizes
- vary presentation (size, contrast)
- vary modality (audio, braille)
- accessibility
- lacks semantic structure (tags for titles, heading levels, sections, paragraphs, lists, emphasis, code, links, accessibility features, etc)
- some users can’t read the image due to lack of alt text
- users can’t adapt the text for dyslexia or vision impairments
- systems can’t read the text to them or send it to braille devices
- searchability: the “text” isn’t indexable by search engine in a meaningful way
- fault tolerance: no text fallback if
- image breaks
- image host is geoblocked due to insane regulations.
Contrary to age & humble appearance, text is an advanced technology that provides all these capabilities absent from images.
I am not sure what you are trying to argue. This isn’t about whether text is a good medium, it is about screenshots of texts not being memes.
no excuse for breaking accessibility by not at the very least setting alt text
Oh, I get it. You are not trying to argue the topic but another topic. Sorry, but you should make a seperate post for that, because, you know, seperate topic, seperate discussion.
- searchability: the “text” isn’t indexable by search engine in a meaningful way
Well ok, neither is Lemmy.
lemmy has a search feature broken by inaccessible images of text
True
- usability
100% agree.
In this meme, the author doesn’t understand the word meme.
