The plans - which are subject to a 12-week public consultation - seek to prevent smoking, vaping and the use of heated tobacco in these settings across England.
Afaik theres no passive smoking with vapes so this seems like yet another “think of the kids” populist bullshit.
Or, hear me out: Ban cars and vapes. Problem solved.
Murder all children, problem solved
You’ve seen Comedians in Cars Getting Coffee. Now check out the new show Vaping in Cars with Children.
I was such a happy child when cigarettes in restaurants were banned. That little barrier wall had no chance against the smoke. We had to leave so many restaurants because mother and twin were very allergic (I’m less breaking into hives allergic). I wonder if it’ll come out these are as bad as cigarettes with second hand? Or that the ceos know the same.
That’s funny, I don’t remember putting metals in my eLiquid when I made it
It’s almost as if the whole article is founded upon a false premise
Nah, I must have just forgotten from the lead poisoning
Now also ban smoking/vaping in any vehicle when on the road.
I have had to inhale the secondary when cycling and have had to either stop and change my route or hold my breath and anaerobically overtake to prevent getting filled.Is there any evidence that second hand vapour has adverse health effects? Or are we just banning things we don’t like.
Some flavors, juices, heating elements and brands generally (mostly cheap disposable nicotine vapes). The popcorn lung BS below is from a single flavor that’s banned. The real answer is there’s still very little research and what is there isn’t very comprehensive. The cheap disposable nic salt ones might be harmful second hand. Max VG 0nic on a titanium temp control heating element with some simple strawberry flavor probably isn’t. Lot of variables to control for that no one seems interested in doing science on.
We just need a few more decades to accumulate data. Then a few more decades to uncover the fact that the manufacturers suppressed the data so that they could continue to make money. And a few more decades of legal battles. And by that time it’s already normalized so what’s the big deal anyway?
See also:
- leaded gasoline
- unleaded gasoline
- methane/natural gas
- coal
- “clean” coal
- chlorofluorocarbons
- freon
- tobacco
You didn’t even read what i typed. Bot
You didn’t even read what i typed.
“Just needs more research”
Bot
Whatever helps you sleep at night.
😂
Vapes produce far more volatile volumes than cigarettes, mostly unknown chemicals from Chinese chemical plants. Heating glycerol in a vape pen produces dihydroactetone, a known carcinogen.
Vaping in a car is basically letting kids into a hardware store to huff random chemicals.
Any OSHA inspection with that level of volatiles would shut down a factory.
Children shouldn’t be forced to inhale drugs against their will
But they don’t? The vapor would never reach the kids unless it’s blown directly into their face.
Noone should be forced to inhale any psychoactive substance against their will.
True, but most people have more agency than a child in the backseat of a car
Yes. And me, who left my job to be now unemployed is a pretty good example of it.
there is evidence vaping is extremely harmful to your lungs. possibly moreso than smoking.
and we know that “second hand smoking” is a thing with it sooooo.
yes. there is evidence
Source?
I know their source… their arse.
None of that says it’s worse than smoking. Smoking gives you cancer.
Pretty sure the consensus in the medical field is that vaping is less bad than smoking and if switching to vapes helps you quit tobacco that’s a net positive, but ideally you should do neither.
Vape pens produce multiple carcinogenic volatile compounds.
I doubt you will read that.
I can’t be bothered to explain it to you:
The reality of the “delta” in harm between vaping and smoking is defined by the fundamental difference between aerosolisation and combustion. While vaping is not risk-free, major health organisations and longitudinal chemical analyses indicate that it is significantly less harmful than combustible tobacco.
- The 95% Harm Differential Public Health England and the Royal College of Physicians maintain a long-standing estimate that vaping is at least 95% less harmful than smoking tobacco.
- Toxicant Exposure: Levels of key toxicants in e-cigarette aerosols are typically more than 99% lower than those found in cigarette smoke.
- Chemical Complexity: Tobacco smoke contains over 7,000 chemicals, including 70 known carcinogens. In contrast, e-cigarette aerosol is composed of significantly fewer chemicals, primarily propylene glycol, vegetable glycerine, nicotine, and flavourings.
- Biomarkers: Research shows that smokers who switch entirely to vaping have substantially lower exposure to harmful substances, with biomarker levels similar to those using medical nicotine replacement therapy (NRT).
- Combustion vs. Aerosolisation The primary reason for the harm delta is the absence of fire.
- Combustion (Smoking): Burning tobacco creates tar, carbon monoxide, and a cocktail of oxidizing agents and poisons.
- Aerosolisation (Vaping): Vaping involves heating a liquid to create a vapour without burning. Most health harms from smoking are caused by the products of combustion, not the nicotine itself.
- Potential Harms and Variables Despite the reduced risk profile, vaping introduces unique variables that can influence its safety:
- Device Performance: Toxin formation, such as the production of dihydroxyacetone (DHA) or formaldehyde, is highly dependent on device design and temperature management.
- Wicking Efficiency: Poorly saturated wicks (dry hits) or excessive wattage can cause the thermal degradation of solvents, leading to higher levels of harmful byproducts.
- Emerging Risks: While long-term data (beyond 20 years) is still being collected, some studies suggest vaping may impact lung lipid homeostasis or cardiovascular function, though these effects are generally less severe than those caused by smoking.
- Public Misperception Recent data indicates a growing “misperception gap”:
- In 2024, approximately 50% of adults incorrectly believed vaping is as or more harmful than smoking.
- By 2025, this figure rose to 56%, despite continued scientific evidence of vaping’s lower relative risk.
- Experts note that these misperceptions may prevent smokers from switching to a significantly less harmful alternative.
possibly worse is what I wrote.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bronchiolitis_obliterans?wprov=sfla1
this is one of the things these articles talk about. also referred to as “popcorn lungs”. I’d call this worse, but it being subjective and all I can’t talk for anyone else.
Popcorn lung was discovered in popcorn factories, so those types of flavours are not used in vapes anymore.
These food flavourings have also been tested by billions of people when baking.
Of course, if you inhale nothing but flavoured vape juice, like the rat in the trial, then obviously it’s going to cause harm.
Vaping is not worse than smoking on any level. It’s about 95% better.
A few UK MDs got behind vaping, with $$$ from Phillip Morris, who heavily invested in vapes. It’s not hard to find sellout MDs, especially in the UK - remember Andrew Wakefield?
That “source” was before any research into vape compounds.
BTW, it took decades before there was population evidence of tobacco smoke and cancer.
There is not a pulmonologist on this planet that calls vaping safer than anything.
ah yes, the 1 source against the 4 I posted…
edit: which is also over a decade old! you had to dig back to 2015 to find this.
cool dude.
edit 2: your actual source. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5a8171a7e5274a2e87dbda91/McNeill-Hajek_report_authors_note_on_evidence_for_95_estimate.pdf
says that the chemicals in vaping “have not been assosiated with any serious risk”. which means they have yet to be found harmful.
most of the ways we figure out that stuff is harmful is later. and when we do stuff with chemicals. this is when they would use these “popcorn factory smells” you’re talking about. back in 2015, the ones you said we moved away from?
yet it’s also so called “95% more safe”…
Lol, no there’s absolutely no evidence at all.
It’s impossible to discuss this topic with nicotine addicts on the internet.
Search on PubMed, it’s fast and free.
Several sources are cited upstairs.
The act of heating nicotine produces cancerous products, not to mention the formaldehyde…
The big problem is burning glycerol produces dihydroactetone, and a huge amount of it gets sucked into lungs while vaping.
This compound is a huge concern in sunscreens, but people don’t ingest sunscreen.
Imagine being a shill for big industry like that. this is the same shit ppl said in the 50s for smoking.
At least try to lick a boot that doesnt harm everyone around you?
These are addicts and their brains are reprogrammed to keep the drug coming above any reason.
I hated riding in cars with cigarette smoke.
4 yo me: coughs intermittently for several minutes
Mother of the year: angrily stabs out her cigarette and waves her hand over the ashtray a few times “There! It’s out! Shut up!”
Me: continues coughing as the windows are all up and a literal hand wave does jack shit
I’m so grateful none of my family smoked (even grandparents), but I fucking hated when a friend’s parents did crap like that. Fortunately my childhood was the time period when in my country that stopped being seen as acceptable. I also remember friends’ parents being weirdly combative about the idea that they should wear a seat belt
The whole “seatbelts can trap you, it’s safer to be thrown clear of the collision” nonsense survived well into my lifetime. It’s a mind-bogglingly stupid concept that far outlived the active propaganda campaign. I didn’t start wearing a seatbelt until I started driving, which in hindsight is hard to believe. But buckling up was the exception and not the rule when I was a kid in the 80s.
Good times…plus that yellow brown oily residue on everything. And they say it’s not healthy!
Good
Alright but those kids are going to get cold waiting outside while I finish my vape break
I didn’t realize cars could have children.
Oh boy have you misunderstood the fuck cars movement
tf do you think McQueen was born?
Dark Satanic Rituals.
